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So, I promised people on Twitter I would write a post about how my second GIC appointment went. If you want to remind yourself about how my first appointment went, here's the post I made about it. Like last time, ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif) snowfields accompanied me to the GIC, although this time he stayed in the waiting room.
The second appointment didn't go as planned. The main reason for this is that, as you'll have noticed in the post I just linked, my second appointment was meant to be on November 10th.
No, I didn't forget what date it was supposed to be on! But some miscommunication meant that I was under the impression the appointment had been moved to the 14th.
A few weeks ago, I had received a letter from the GIC with appointment details on them. Because of the proximity to the actual appointment date, and because I only knew about the appointment I had earlier booked, I had assumed it was a simple reminder letter. But it was different to how I expected it to be, because the appointment listed on it was on the 14th instead of the 10th.
Later on, I called the GIC about this. I first asked to confirm the appointment for the 14th, to make sure that was correct, which it was. I then asked why the appointment date had changed from the 10th to the 14th. The receptionist wasn't able to tell me why it might have happened, eventually concluding that it had probably been rescheduled because the person I would be seeing had no clinic on that day.
Of course, the reason she was unable to tell me why it had changed was because that particular appointment *hadn't* actually changed; it was a second appointment with no relation to the first. I had assumed that the letter meant that the date had changed, when it hadn't.
So, it turned out I had missed the appointment for the 10th to see the second psychiatrist (the first being Dr. Andrew Davies, as detailed in the other post). It turned out that *this* appointment was to see an endocrinologist about the results of the blood test that I'd had done last time (and which I see I failed to mention in the post - sorry!). Apparently there were some abnormalities in my blood test results and they wanted to ask questions about me and my family, and examine me physically.
It turned out that the blood test results showed that I had a higher level of FSH than is normal. Based on this (and possibly the physical examinations - I can't remember when they said this), it means that there's apparently a chance that I might actually not have XY chromosomes, but XXY chromosomes. To confirm this they wanted me to take more blood tests, and they also wanted to see other things from the blood test too, like my bone marrow density. They also wanted to retest my baselines - that is, the levels of hormones that I have. So, I went along to the hospital again to have more blood taken. This time they took about 10 (or so) blood sample bottles full - quite a lot!
With regard to the appointments... when I realised that I had missed the appointment on the 10th, it upset me a lot; I actually started crying right there at the GIC. It meant that there was no way I was going to get hormones that day (though Fated reminded me later that I was probably not going to get them anyway considering that they want to retake my baselines), but more importantly, I was worried because the GIC's policy for patients not attending the first and second assessments was to discharge back to the GP.
Thankfully, it didn't happen this way. I'm not entirely sure why - maybe they realised what the problem had been. In any case, because of the mixup, they offered to reschedule me for the next available appointment instead of rescheduling for six months down the line like they'd normally do.
So, the appointment that I was *supposed* to have on the 10th will now be in three weeks, on the 5th of December. In addition, I have another appointment with the endocrinologist in June.
And to end this on a good note, it occurred to me while writing this that if the blood test results come back within those three weeks, it's *possible* that I may be able to get hormones then. If I had attended the appointment on the 10th, I wouldn't have been able to get them until my next proper appointment (because they'd have wanted to retest baselines), which would almost certainly have been months in the future.
I do hope I can get hormones in three weeks, and ask about voice therapy.
Post A Comment | 22 Comments | Add to Memories | Tell Someone | Link
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![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png) shanaqui |
| 2011-11-16 02:08 (UTC) |
| (Rikku) So alive |
| (no subject) |
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My fingers are crossed for you. Good luck.
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Good luck. >.> I get so terrified when I realize I might not get what I need after all.
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| delight |
| 2011-11-16 03:36 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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I'm not an endocrinologist, but from what I know (which is RN level and nonspecialized), having Klinefelter's may yet make your transition easier when it comes to things like the readjustment of fat deposits and changing in body shape; you may find it less unpleasant than some have warned, and while I don't know the statistics you should have an easier time in the department of breast development. (Some may also argue that Klinefelter's means you are actually female regardless of how your body presents, despite having the Y chromosome; I try to stay away from these genetic debates professionally.)
So it is really weird to say "maybe congratulations, if you have that extra chromosome!" but it was the first thing that popped into my head. And then even though it felt weird to say, it felt weirder to not say, because I thought it!
Good luck getting your hormones ASAP, and not finding any considered-abnormalities that actually cause you any harm. Fingers and toes crossed for you!
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| sophie |
| 2011-11-16 03:51 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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(Some may also argue that Klinefelter's means you are actually female regardless of how your body presents, despite having the Y chromosome; I try to stay away from these genetic debates professionally.)
Considering that I'm fairly sure that wouldn't go down well with XXY men, I'm probably not going to take that on for myself. It would be wrong of me to say that about myself when the implications would extend to *all* XXY people. In any case, I thought that as far as human genetics was concerned, having a Y at all was supposed to indicate a male? Or is that considered outdated thinking? I don't know enough about genetics to know.
I'll be honest, I've already known that I'm pretty lucky in terms of transition ease, so it doesn't come as an absolute surprise to hear that things might be made easier. It's still very good to hear, of course, and it sounds like it might affect more than I expected!
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| delight |
| 2011-11-16 04:06 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Well, yeah, I would definitely not agree with it, knowing some XXY men! People also insist that all XY females are males, even though many of them aren't, physically or mentally.
So, well: the basic version is that Y means male, but sometimes it doesn't. Nothing in biology ever wants to be predictable.
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| sophie |
| 2011-11-16 04:12 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Okay, so the Y-means-male thinking is just plain outdated, then. I thought it might be but didn't know enough to know for sure. Thanks!
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| sophie |
| 2011-11-17 02:09 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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I was actually going by what I had read on Wikipedia while I was reading up on various genetic things. On https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/XXYY_syndrome , it says "The appearance of at least one Y chromosome makes a male. Therefore, XXYY only affects males."
So I guess this doesn't reflect modern thinking on genetics?
[edit: And yes, I know I don't have XXYY; I went on a wiki walk.]
Edited 2011-11-17 02:10 am (UTC)
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| danni |
| 2011-11-17 02:13 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Well, it's mostly there. The presence of the SRY gene (which I don't think can be masked?), along with uncorrupted copies of the required genes (see my comment below) will cause male structural differentiation.
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| (Anonymous) |
| 2012-12-16 02:26 (UTC) |
| Y=male=infertile |
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Y still means male. As in, if you are not sterile, and have a Y chromosome in there, you can only possibly reproduce as a male does.
An xy "female" is always sterile, as far as any non-self-contradictory studies to date indicate. Find me an xy who can reproduce as female and I'll concede.
Xx/xy mosaics do NOT count for obv reasons.
The xy androgen insensitive male will look female, but is not truly one, because female means fertile. And no one with a Y is.
Female is the default sex.
-Indie Scholar Extrordinaire
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| geekosaur |
| 2011-11-17 00:31 (UTC) |
| biohazard |
| (no subject) |
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Considering that you can go a very long ways toward feminizing an otherwise male fetus (including development of a uterus and ovaries in place of a penis, IIRC) just by exposing it to additional estrogen at the right times, the chromosomal makeup is pretty close to irrelevant.
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| geekosaur |
| 2011-11-17 01:52 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Hrm, I was under the impression that under influence of estrogen, they developed (or at least began development) but didn't work. It's not a single (or simple) switch, and you can get all sorts of (mostly nonfunctional) intermediate phases depending on various factors.
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| danni |
| 2011-11-17 02:03 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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The SRY gene is meant to be the switch (translocation of the SRY gene onto the X chromosome can cause XX males, similarly absence or corruption of the SRY gene on the Y chromosome can cause XY females).
What makes it not so simple is that there's lots of possibilities for corruption here: corrupt genes that fail to produce the correct hormones, a corrupt gene for the androgen receptor (the cause of Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome -- which is why people with AIS do not have features suppressed by AMH but also do not have the features activated by DHT), a corrupt SRY gene, a corrupt SOX9 gene (which is activated by the SRY gene).
Testosterone can be metabolised into estradiol and so is present to some level in all humans. While estrogen plays no role in determining the primary sex characteristics of humans, it does have a role in the secondary sex characteristics during puberty: breast development, fat distribution, skin texture and thickness, etc.
Edited 2011-11-17 02:03 am (UTC)
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| (Anonymous) |
| 2012-12-16 02:33 (UTC) |
| Functional and of the rule |
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Non-functional! That is key! Functional is obviously the evolutionary ideal. All arguments made from either
a) the exception to the rule (intersex)
or
b) non-functionality
are not acceptable. There's such a big push to get us to pretend males are females and that female is not the default sex. Bizarre and highly suspect.
Thank you.
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| danni |
| 2011-11-17 02:30 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Considering that I'm fairly sure that wouldn't go down well with XXY men, I'm probably not going to take that on for myself.
I agree. I think doing so is actually transphobic. Since there is a disconnect between genetic sex, physiological sex and gender identity; one informs, but does not dictate the next (well society informs the last one off the first two).
I have known trans people, seemingly unable to accept their transness and spend a lot of time looking for an intersex condition they can pin on themselves, finally labelling themselves undelectably brain intersexed. I have come across intersex people who told trans people that they weren't real because they have a well-defined sex.
I don't know if this will affect you, but the DSM says you can't be diagnosed with GID if you're intersex: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity_disorder#Diagnostic_criteria
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| sophie |
| 2011-11-17 02:38 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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I'm not sure what definition is used for 'intersex', and if the potential XXY chromosomal makeup would count as that, but I do notice that that specifically says "In the United States". I'm not sure what it would be like in the UK.
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O.o Ten vials of blood? Geez.
Also, I'm so glad they didn't discharge you for missing that appointment. And I hope you can get hormones sooner than later. I deeply hope.
-Lana
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| mfb |
| 2011-11-17 02:56 (UTC) |
| hanar |
| (no subject) |
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I am really happy if the XXY turnout makes your transition easier! But I am uncomfortable with genetics having any bearing on who gets hormones and who doesn't. Is that the way it works?
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| sophie |
| 2011-11-17 13:11 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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As I understand it, no. I think the idea is that with my high FSH level, they need to test to see what the right quantities of hormones to give would be. Also, I believe XXY people can have some physiological issues which would also affect the quantity that's safest to give.
But there's no bar on getting hormones because of genetics, so far as I know.
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| (Anonymous) |
| 2011-11-21 17:31 (UTC) |
| (no subject) |
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Etoile here, I forget my DW info.
If you are XXY, I have a friend who can give you some info on that. He was diagnosed with Klinefelter's at 19 or so.
Have patience, it will come! They just want to make sure you are healthy first. :)
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| (Anonymous) |
| 2012-01-05 20:43 (UTC) |
| transgender |
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I believe I am an xy female. I always felt different as a kid. My vaginal lips are big but not really like a penis just big. I asked my mom if I was a boy and she said no. This was when I was like 5 yeears old. I look female and have a dominant male like personality. I also am a bit of a misogynist and get along with mwen better than women. I am bisexual and dating an xxy male. I really feel I am an xy female. I take birthcontrol since the age of fourteen and when I don't take it I get hair growth on my body and face. I also become moody and angry. I am 30 years old and I don't know what to do. I really want o find out if I am xy. Is there someone that can help me? my email is j.blazick@gmail.com. Please email me if you want to talk about transgender issues.
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